Muzzle-Loading Guns, rifles & pistols. Police Seizure Abuse - The Loose Cannon.

Although I once defied the odds and got nought out of thirty in an open book multiple choice Chemistry test, leading to me studying law and not an agricultural science, Newton’s third law ‘for every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction’, has always appealed to me, because at least on one level it applies to human and organisational behaviour and not just objects.

Thus when Police are affected by something they react.

Most readers would be familiar with the Edwards tragedy last year.  Mr Edwards was granted a special Commissioner's Permit for a handgun, against the wishes of a gun club he had previously approached, and then he went oput and commited a murder suicide soon after.  Further compounding the tragedy, his distraught former spouse committed suicide earlier this year. 

Police did not blame themselves for granting the permit, and are now targeting anyone who shoots and who is involved in a Family Law break up.

Case in point, I am acting for a small dealer at present who is in the process of going through a break up with his spouse.  The parties are separated under the one roof.

On my instructions his former partner was somewhat jealous because he was having a discussion and was actively engaged in play with his son. His wife’s mother suggested she call Police, which she proceeded to do.

Police attended, and as no threat was made, and there was no apprehension of violence, no AVO was issued.

Nevertheless, my client’s licence was suspended.  The reason on the suspension was ‘child at risk’- yet there was on these facts no evidence of this.  The only thing that happened that night that would have been scary to a child was the arrival of two Police Officers after the child’s bed time - although I stress that in this particular situation the officers behaved commendably well, and only followed instructions.

Not every child in a break up is a child at risk, and if Police wanted to target children at risk their attention would be better spent visiting shopping centres and rounding up truanting children during the day, and getting tired drivers off the road.

As you may be aware, Police policy of seizure, for a ‘cooling off period’ of 28 days, does not appear to have any statutory basis and any seizure of firearms needs to comply with Firearms Act 1996 or the Law Enforcement (Powers and Responsibilities) Act 2002.

The Police power to suspend a Firearms licence is set out in paragraph 22 of the Firearms Act 1996, and I have set it out below.

22   Suspension of licence

(cf APMC 6, 1989 Act s 35)

(1)  The Commissioner may, if the Commissioner is satisfied there may be grounds for revoking a licence, suspend the licence by serving personally or by post on the licensee a notice:

(a)  stating that the licence is suspended and the reasons for suspending it, and

(b)  requesting that the person provide the Commissioner with reasons why the licence should not be revoked.

(1A) If a licence is being suspended because the Commissioner is satisfied that there may be grounds for revoking the licence under section 11 (5A), the notice suspending the licence is not required:

(a)  to state the reasons for the suspension, or

(b)  to include any request that the licensee provide the Commissioner with reasons why the licence should not be revoked.

(2)  The Commissioner must suspend a licence in accordance with this section if the Commissioner is aware that the licensee has been charged with a domestic violence offence within the meaning of the Crimes (Domestic and Personal Violence) Act 2007 or the Commissioner has reasonable cause to believe that the licensee has committed or has threatened to commit a domestic violence offence within the meaning of that Act.

(3)  A suspended licence does not authorise the possession or use of firearms during the period specified in the notice suspending it.

Whilst not relevant, I shall set out section 11(5) below for your convenience

11(5) A licence must not be issued to a person who:

(a)  is under the age of 18, or

(b)  has, within the period of 10 years before the application for the licence was made, been convicted in New South Wales or elsewhere of an offence prescribed by the regulations, whether or not the offence is an offence under New South Wales law, or

(c)  is subject to an apprehended violence order or interim apprehended violence order or who has, at any time within 10 years before the application for the licence was made, been subject to an apprehended violence order (other than an order that has been revoked), or

(d)  is subject to a good behaviour bond, whether entered into in New South Wales or elsewhere, in relation to an offence prescribed by the regulations, or

(e)  is subject to a firearms prohibition order, or

(f)  is a registrable person or corresponding registrable person under the Child Protection (Offenders Registration) Act 2000.

Turning to the Law Enforcement (Powers and Responsibilities) Act 2002 which again relevantly provides:

      20   Relevant offences

The following offences are relevant offences for the purposes of this Division:

       (a)  indictable offences,

       (b)  an offence against section 93FB of the Crimes Act 1900,

       (c)  an offence against the Weapons Prohibition Act 1998, the Firearms Act 1996, or a regulation made under either of those Acts,

       (d)  an offence against a provision of Part 2 of the Explosives Act 2003.

      21   Power to search persons and seize and detain things without warrant

      (cf Crimes Act 1900, ss 357, 357E, Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act 1985, s 37)

       (1)  A police officer may, without a warrant, stop, search and detain a person, and anything in the possession of or under the control of the person, if the police officer suspects on reasonable grounds that any of the following circumstances exists:

       (a)  the person has in his or her possession or under his or her control anything stolen or otherwise unlawfully obtained,

       (b)  the person has in his or her possession or under his or her control anything used or intended to be used in or in connection with the commission of a relevant offence,

       (c)  the person has in his or her possession or under his or her control in a public place a dangerous article that is being or was used in or in connection with the commission of a relevant offence,

       (d)  the person has in his or her possession or under his or her control, in contravention of the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act 1985, a prohibited plant or a prohibited drug.

       (2)  A police officer may seize and detain:

       (a)  all or part of a thing that the police officer suspects on reasonable grounds is stolen or otherwise unlawfully obtained, and

       (b)  all or part of a thing that the police officer suspects on reasonable grounds may provide evidence of the commission of a relevant offence, and

       (c)  any dangerous article, and

       (d)  any prohibited plant or prohibited drug in the possession or under the control of a person in contravention of the Drug Misuse and Trafficking Act 1985,

       found as a result of a search under this section.

      22   Power to seize and detain dangerous articles on premises

      (cf Crimes Act 1900, s 357)

A police officer who is lawfully on any premises may seize and detain any dangerous article that the police officer finds on the premises, if the police officer suspects on reasonable grounds that the dangerous article is being or was used in or in connection with the commission of a relevant offence.

 Premises include vessels, vehicles, aircraft and other places.

       The difficulty for Police here is that while a firearm is a dangerous article within the meaning of s21(2)(c) there is no relevant offence, nor is there any suspicion on reasonable grounds that the article is or was used in commission of an offence (s22).

After realising that they were on shakey grounds a Sergeant rang my client, alluded to gaol, and referenced the following alleged offences, none of which are supported by available evidence.

1.     That my client was in possession of 14 unregistered firearms.  This allegation was denied.  My client had completed all PAB28 and 31 paperwork as required by legislation as required and had forwarded these to the Registry by Registered Post.  My client also completed his quarterly return with respect to these entries and forwarded the quarterly return to the Registry by Registered Post.  Apparently, Police wish to hold my client responsible for processing tardiness at their Registry.

     That my client was in possession of a number of prohibited firearms specifically firearms fitted with a folding stock. Allegation admitted. My client is authorised by virtue of his dealer licence to possess prohibited firearms no 11 of Sch 1 of the Firearms Act 1996, item 11 are any firearms fitted with a folding stock.

1.     That my client was informed he would be asked why one firearm had a defaced serial number.  Upon entering details of all firearms acquired by my client the physical serial number of the firearm was sighted at all times when making these entries.  My client can answer no explanation why one has a defaced serial number he questions if part of a serial number may be partially obscured by a stock.  I requested further particulars.
2.     The Sergeant informed my client that his decision to suspend my client in the morning of 9 May 2019 was supported by an allegation involving matrimonial property.  On the 8 May 2019 attending Police referred to this as a civil matter, and it was not raised as a complaint until the afternoon of the 9 May 2019. For this reason, this allegation was not raised on the Suspension Notice and had no bearing upon the decision to suspend.

My criticism is with a Police Policy in practice in respect to domestic situations that exceeds the law, and that involves the seizure of firearms without probable cause merely on suspicion of a domestic break up. 

Just because Firearms ownership is a privilege and not a right, does not mean that privilege is subject to unfettered discretion by Police to seize firearms or suspend licences without appropriate due process.

When I first came to Australia, I was amazed how far this country has progressed since it was a penal colony, a mere couple of hundred years ago.  However the longer I practice law, the more convinced I am that my assumption is wrong, for certainly in terms of Police attitude, this state is still a Penal Colony.

Simon Munslow

National Firearms Lawyer
P: (02) 6299 9690
M: 0427 280 962
E: solicitor@bigpond.com
W: firearmslawyer.com.au

Simon Munslow is a lawyer who has a lifelong interest in shooting, having acquired his first firearm at the age of nine, and has had an active interest in firearms law since writing a thesis on the topic over thirty years ago at University.
Simon Munslow practices extensively in Firearms Law matters throughout Australia.

He is a regular contributor to the Australian Sporting Shooter magazine’s website on Firearms law matters, has published articles on firearms reviews and firearms law, and occasionally is asked to comment in the broader media on firearms matters.

This article is written for general information only and does not constitute advice. 
He can assist you with:

Criminal law & Administrative law and in particular that related to Firearms

• All firearms, weapons and game charges
• Avoiding & setting aside Apprehended Violence Orders
• Possession of unregistered firearms
• Unsafe transportation & storage matters
• Applications for prohibited weapons
• License Appeals
• Freedom of Information / Government Public Access matters
• Importation & Customs problems
• Advices & opinions related to Firearms law matters

Read more at http://www.sportingshooter.com.au/latest/police-seizure-abuse-the-loose-cannon#iq2kiJvR6Pw57ZCw.99
http://www.sportingshooter.com.au/latest/police-seizure-abuse-the-loose-cannon

Only 20 People Signed!!!

APR 3, 2018 — The Barwon region alone which makes up most of north-west NSW, tops the list with 8,617 gun owners, & yet only 20 people have signed my petition. I think this is proof enough that gun owners in Australia DO NOT support each other, we are fractured & we are our own worst enemy.
If you are a gun owner & you have a good reason for not signing my petition, then PLEASE let me know what that reason is. I think that I am making a very reasonable request, so do you have a reason not to sign my petition, or do you just not give a damn?!
Keith H. Burgess
NECLHG NSW.

PETITION HERE: https://www.change.org/p/to-the-honourable-the-speaker-and-members-of-the-legislative-assembly-of-new-south-wales-in-parliam-muzzle-loading-pistols-to-be-placed-on-a-less-restrictive-licence/u/22588438

Black Powder Firearms Laws In Poland Vs Australia.

Here in Australia we have to have a Firearms licence & pass a firearms test to obtain that licence. A permit to purchase, & we have to register all guns including replica muzzle-loading guns. A replica muzzle-loading gun is the same as an identical antique muzzle-loading gun, no difference. It still loads from the muzzle, it still relies on a flint lock for ignition. But in Poland, which has the most stringent firearms laws in the world, you do not require a permit to purchase, a licence or registration. Only the gunpowder needs to be registered.

- BLACK POWDER FIREARMS IN POLAND:

Blackpowder not integrated cartridge guns, if manufactured before 1885, and their replicas also multiple shot revolvers (separable loading only) are available without any restrictions (Owner must to be over 18). They are also permitted to be owned, used, and carried (You name it) loaded without any permits. Curiously though, the purchase of the blackpowder requires registration.

On Firearms Control In Australia By Robert Borsak.

Robert Borsak

20 hrs

Today I was asked by Fox News in London to comment on whether or not Australia's firearms laws work to stop crime in light of the decision by President Obama to reform American gun laws.

Our advocacy is being internationally recognized and it is about time that law abiding firearms owners get a fair go.

The show will air soon and we will get a copy of the segment as soon as we can get our hands on it.

In the meantime, here are my thoughts as an Australian law abiding firearm owner:

As President Obama attempts to reform America gun laws, the issue of gun control and violence is yet again in the spotlight. My thoughts and sentiments on this are not centred around American gun control or gun culture per se, but rather the Australian experience.

It is deeply disturbing that every time the issue of gun control is debated in America or other jurisdictions for that matter, Australian guns laws are hailed as the gold standard – a benchmark for leaders to achieve. Well, they are not.

As a starting point, we are not America, we do not have a constitutional right to bear arms, and in fact our constitution does not afford ordinary citizens many rights at all. Instead, what we have is an array of draconian and impractical state and national firearms laws, underpinned by a ‘Howard’ mentality that somehow regulating law abiding people will deter crime.

But the facts and evidence fly in the face of many of these ‘anti-gun’ lies and misinformation.

In late 2015, following intensive discussions with Robert Brown and I, the NSW Deputy Premier and Police Minister, Troy Grant, rightly pointed out what the Shooters and Fishers Party have been saying for over 20 years, “Greater than 97% of all firearms incidents reported in NSW relate to unregistered, or unbranded, or unmarked firearms… NSW has an illegal firearm problem”.

This has been the reality in Australia for decades. The vast majority of firearms crimes committed are done so with the use of an illegal or unregistered firearm by an unlicensed individual.

Logic dictates then, does it not, that the Government should focus the vast majority of its time and resources on curbing the illegal firearms trade and tough sentencing measures? Rather, successive governments have spent over a billion dollars on targeting law abiding firearms owners through failed registration schemes, confiscation and pointless “tough gun control” measures.

Further, independent and statistical research indicates that the regulation, including banning, of firearms, has little to no causal effect on the rate of crime. The Melbourne Institute of Applied Economic and Social Research published a working paper on The Australian Firearms Buyback and Its Effect on Gun Deaths, which ultimately concluded that the NFA did not have large or long-term effects on reducing firearms homicide or suicide rates in Australia.

Our gun laws are nothing to be proud of. In fact, they represent one of the most vile and draconian attacks on personal freedoms and culture. They have been formed, and continue to be formed, on lies, political mileage and misinformation.

In 1996, the Howard Government decided that we couldn’t be trusted with semi-automatic rifles and pump action shotguns anymore, yet it seems criminals didn’t get the message?

Even today, the ordinary Australian citizens cringes or questions me when I tell them I love shooting and hunting. I don’t blame them though. I blame the collective efforts of politicians like John Howard, anti-gun groups like The Australian Greens and Gun Control Australia, and most of the media. This atmosphere of paranoia and ignorance was created by them. It is our job to unwind the damage and further our rights in the process.

Licensed firearms owners are among the few classes of people that are acknowledged and endorsed as fit and proper persons. Criminals are not allowed to obtain firearms licences period. Ownership and use of a firearm is a highly held privilege. With that privilege we have the right not to be associated with or disadvantaged by the action of senseless cowards. Relaxing firearms laws to make it easier and more practical for law abiding citizens to enjoy their sport and cultural pastimes is not going to result in a mass shooting or spike in gun crime.

To my fellow law abiding firearm owners, and to anyone who truly values personal freedoms and fact based decision making, I say this: The fight for the roll back of these firearms laws will be a generational struggle, but united, we have a strong and growing voice that will not be silenced!

 https://www.facebook.com/groups/1502950643337038/permalink/1523002614665174/

More On Gun Control. Best video I have seen to date. PLEASE SHARE.

The best 7 minutes of gun control speech.

This is the BEST and smartest gun argument I have heard yet...THIS MUST GO VIRAL!!!

Posted by Rik Sexton on Thursday, 28 March 2013

Firearms Legislation !!! A Message to all anti-gun people.